"Obama 2012 ~ Because the Other Side is Nuts"

by: HappyinVT

Sun Feb 19, 2012 at 16:38:05 PM EST

I stole that from John Cole and I hope he doesn't mind.  But he's hardly alone in thinking it.

... the GOP is intellectually stagnant. To disagree with the dominant GOP zeitgeist is tantamount to heresy. Everyone must toe the hard-right line of religious conservatives who ignore not only science but also obvious realities.

That's from a Republican ~ a self-professed member of the "rational wing of the Republican Party."  They exist but, particularly if Rick Santorum is the GOP presidential nominee, they may vote in some number for the Democratic nominee because, as was the case with Mr. Cole and Charles Johnson of Little Green Footballs, the Republican Party left them.

HappyinVT :: "Obama 2012 ~ Because the Other Side is Nuts"
I usually leave the deep-thinking analysis of politics (and a lot of other things) to those Moose who are much better thinkers and writers.  In this case, I'm leaving it to Ron Hill who wrote at Pam's House Blend the quote above and other great things:

My hope is that rational conservatives will then work to help bring the GOP back to the common-sense middle. The truth is that our party has gone off the deep end. It's as if  we're watching the slow, painful death of a major political party.

It seems to me Mitt Romney could have done that.  He could have owned Romneycare and pointed out why it was good policy.  But then he'd have been too much like President Obama which many on the Right hold against him.  After all one of the architects of both healthcare bills recently said "they are the same fucking bill."  Instead Romney ran to the Right which many predicted he'd have to do to have a chance for the nomination.  And now despite that  conservatives are still looking for a "true conservative" as the non-Romney nominee.

... we had Michele Bachmann, whose only redeeming quality was making Sarah Palin look informed and thoughtful by way of comparison.


Most recently, we were treated to Newt Gingrich, the thrice-divorced serial adulterer who - ironically - was the darling of the "family values" crowd. Among other extreme views, Mr. Gingrich seemed to imply that America should bring back child labor.

And now we have Rick Santorum the same guy who lost his re-election bid by 18%, the second largest loss by an incumbent Republican ever.  Most folks wrote Santorum off early because he was in the Tim Pawlenty area of polling and the guy holds policy positions largely outside of the mainstream (he's freakin' nuts).  But nooooo, Santorum won the Missouri, Minnesota AND Colorado primaries/caucuses.  This changed the narrative despite netting Santorum zero delegates.  Now recent polling has Santorum up in Michigan and Ohio, and behind by single-digits in Arizona.  Mike DeWine the current AG in Ohio switched his endorsement from Romney to Santorum late last week.  Will that alone win Santorum the nonination?  Likely not but I do wonder if that gives other Romney endorsers pause or might hold off future endorsements.

So is Rick Santorum likely to be the Republican nominee for president?  My gut says "probably not" but then again I would never have thought that Rick Santorum would win any primaries or caucuses or would lead in states like Michigan or Ohio (Oklahoma or Kansas, maybe).  But will Santorum shoot himself in the metaphorical foot with some of his crazier notions?

Voluntary euthanasia in The Netherlands:


Birth Control:


Jihadist training camps in Latin America:


Ending pre-natal testing because it leads to more abortions:


He lambasted the president's health care law requiring insurance policies to include free prenatal testing, "because free prenatal testing ends up in more abortions and therefore less care that has to be done because we cull the ranks of the disabled in our society."

Say wha??????

Santorum can't seem to help himself.  And while part of me hopes he can keep the lid on the worst of the crazy long enough to win the nomination part of me fears him ::cough::George W. Bush::cough:: while still another part is sorry to see what may be the death of the Republican Party.

Back to our rational Republican:

If I sound harsh on a Republican - it's only because I expect better from the party of Lincoln, Eisenhower and Goldwater. The nation, as well as the GOP, deserve better; the consequences of an intellectually stagnant and moribund Republican party are simply too awful.


The GOP can do better, and America requires better. I've been a conservative all my life, but would have no choice but to vote for President Obama if Rick Santorum is the GOP nominee. Privately, many Republicans tell me the same thing.

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For some reason I cannot embed videos (2.00 / 8)
so I went with links.  My apologies.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

Yes...and we shouldn't rely on this. (2.00 / 8)
It doesn't mean that we don't need to make policy arguments.  It means there is a space in which we can make real policy argument in the vacuous space occupied by the "democrats believe that government knows better than you and should pick winners and losers etc. etc. blah blah blah blah" crowd.  This is when we should be more rigorous and more creative and bolder.  This is an opportunity.  We've been playing policy defense for too long.  We haven't really been on offence with regard to policy rhetoric since LBJ.  This could be the moment when we seize and own and steer the debate.  Elizabeth Warren style.  But I'm pessimistic for some reason...

The future is unwritten

Santorum... (1.91 / 11)
Has pulled back the curtain on a much wider issue.  The "evangelical" movement in the United States is thinly veiled cover for bigotry, racism, selfishness and expectations of ubermenschen entitlement among parochial, xenophobic misanthropes whom are not courageous or intelligent enough to deal with reality and their modest role in it.

After decades of having it patiently explained to them that their deeply held prejudices had no reasonable or scientific basis, in fact were merely dumb and socially repellent, they have chosen to create an artificial reality within the bastion of "faith" in which no external evidence is admissible and their adolescent world-view is somehow protected by the sanctity of religious devotion.

It is a pitiful display of human failing and weakness.  These are people intoxicated by their own delusions who are somehow validated in their tendency towards intolerance and violence by a profound lack of understanding of the solemn teachings of the very religion they claim as bulwark.  If we are Rome these are our Visigoths.  They speak a coded language but share a common purpose; anyone with an open mind and a tolerant soul is their enemy and in their hearts they seek to destroy us for our blasphemy against their bizarre, erroneous and shallow interpretation of Christianity and the role of mastery presumed by their righteousness.

When they say "religious liberty" they mean the divine right to impose their narrow, selfish dogma on us all.  When they speak of their "faith" they are defining us in "heresy."  When they say "freedom of speech" they seek to silence the rest of us in our "apostasy."

As Strummerson noted elsewhere they have adopted the founding fathers as their latter-day prophets and the Constitution as their Third Testament and have co-mingled jingoism and the Christian idolatry of the shopping-mall into a contemptible pagan hash suited to bonfires and lynchings.  These are our modern "Christians," whose literacy and intellectual curiosity is not up to the challenge of actually reading their own Bible or exploring the centuries of contemplation it inspired; who have rejected the Sermon of the Mount and the sober teachings of the Synoptic Gospels for delirious interpretations of Revelations; who are content to have fractured fairy tales served up to them by demagogic personalities railing in favour of whatever prejudice has most recently exercised their intolerance or indignation.

Well they might seek the signs of Satan, the Father of Lies, and obsess over his influence amongst the worldly for they are his own Children and are surfeited in his work.  Let those who have ears hear.

Don't hold back. Say what you really think, Shaun (1.90 / 10)
Wonderful Jeremiad. All I'd add, by way of injecting some historical materialism into your brilliant theological demolition, is that these same people - from Wyoming to Mississippi - who decry the heavy hand of the state and vaunt free enterprise, are those who are actually completely dependent on federal handouts in terms of subsidies, welfare and government grants. The blue liberal cities have fiscally funded the fundies for decades.

How's that for thanks?

The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'

[ Parent ]
Heh... (1.90 / 10)

What was that Real American Value you were spouting a minute ago? Self reliance? Try this for self reliance: buy your own fucking stop signs, assholes.

Fuck the South

It's like having a drunken teenager threaten to burn the house down because you won't give them the keys to the family car.

[ Parent ]
Can somebody say (2.00 / 7)
Amen! ?

[ Parent ]
goddamit (2.00 / 9)
"They're fighting us because they fundamentally disagree with us. They want to eliminate us," he said. "We have two different ideas of what god is, two different ideas of what humanity is, two different ideas of what social justice is."

No, Mr. Santorum, "they" are not fighting us because "we" have a different idea of what "god" is.

Get a grip.

We agree with them - literally - on who god is. We are Muslim. We are Christian. We are atheists and buddhists and new-age pagan crystal huggers.

They may be all Muslim, but we are Muslim too. They hate American Muslims more than they hate you or American Christians. American Muslims may well hate them more than you do, too.

They hate me, and I'm not even involved in the entire "who god is" conversation. They hate you differently than me - more similarly to the way they hate all Muslims who don't agree with them - because you believe in a slightly different version of the same religion.

This isn't "Islam against America", dammit. That isn't even part of this. This is a bunch of extremist Abrahamic religious zealots hating you and every other Abrahmist who disagrees with them. The rest of us caught between all you zealots.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

Preach! (see what I did there?) (2.00 / 8)
You know what's the saddest part?


The latest results from Gallup's daily tracking poll indicate Rick Santorum has overtaken Mitt Romney nationwide and now leads the former Massachusetts governor by an eight-point margin.

According to the poll released Sunday, 36% of registered Republicans said they are backing Santorum, while 28% prefer Romney.

I'm going to say it...

The majority of registered Republicans are fucking idiots.

Just because they are posting on a progressive site doesn't make them progressives. - John Allen

[ Parent ]
Now... (2.00 / 8)
That these dissembling theocrats are squabbling amongst themselves as to who is really the severest conservative of all we can see the actual agendas.  It's not pretty.

[ Parent ]
Fu-gly. (2.00 / 8)
The latest PPP poll from Michigan has Romney making up some ground. Santorum is only up 4 after leading by 15 in the last poll.  Looks like the upcoming debate will be huge.

What I found interesting about the numbers was...


Groups Santorum has double digit leads with include Protestants (up 47-30), union members (up 43-23), Evangelicals (up 51-24), Tea Partiers (up 55-20), 'very conservative' voters (up 54-23), and men (up 40-28).

Romney is leading the field with women (38-34), seniors (42-34), moderates (35-24), 'somewhat conservative' voters (40-34), and Catholics (43-31).

Everything is as it should be except Willard is crushing Ricardo with... Catholics?!?!?

Just because they are posting on a progressive site doesn't make them progressives. - John Allen

[ Parent ]
My WAG on the odd religious splits: (2.00 / 8)
The Evangelicals and fundamentalists among the Protestants take their religious dogmas/antipathies/bigotries severely seriously, so Santorum is their kinda guy.

Meanwhile, the bulk of Catholics, being accustomed to browsing the cafeteria's buffet for so long, aren't as inclined to take up the culture war cudgels.

If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done subjunctively.

[ Parent ]
I know zip about the various religions (2.00 / 8)
but my stereotype had Santorum fully evangelical speaking in tongue (like my sister) in the realm of Palin's church not Catholic.  But folks on the internet tell me he is oh-so RC.

And a hypocrite.  :)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Hmmm... (2.00 / 7)
Sound familiar?:

"I don't believe Opus Dei is either a [cult] or a mafia or a cabal," a senior prelate of another religious community in Rome told TIME. It is just that "their approach is preconciliar. They originated prior to the Second Vatican Council, and they don't want to dialogue with society as they find it." That would not describe the majority of self-identifying American Catholics, who are distinctly postconciliar, with more than 75% opposing the birth-control ban. Their sympathy for Opus Dei might be limited.

Jordan Bonfante - The Ways of Opus Dei Time 16 Apr 06

Seems to describe Santorum's Catholicism to a tee.

[ Parent ]
So... (2.00 / 7)
Here we have a preconciliar Catholic and fellow traveller with an order forged in the falangist crucible of the Spanish Civil War aligned with neo-Confederacy evangelicals in denunciation of mainstream Protestantism:

"We all know that this country was founded on a Judeo-Christian ethic but the Judeo-Christian ethic was a Protestant Judeo-Christian ethic, sure the Catholics had some influence, but this was a Protestant country and the Protestant ethic, mainstream, mainline Protestantism, and of course we look at the shape of mainline Protestantism in this country and it is in shambles, it is gone from the world of Christianity as I see it."

Kyle Mantyla - Santorum: Satan is Systematically Destroying America Right Wing Watch 16 Feb 12

What could possibly go wrong?

[ Parent ]
Speaking in tongues (2.00 / 2)

On the one below, fast-forward to time stamp 08:47.

[ Parent ]
I read that 10% of those polled find Santorum too ... (2.00 / 8)
Liberal.  Seriously.  As some said on Twtter:  "Sweet Jesus, who are these people."

PPP also previewed their AZ and WA polls - Santorum looking good.  Nate has Santorum at 75% to win MI, btw.

A couple of things to me, though.  (And I apologize for the randomness of thought - on phone)  Santorum's MI #s not that much lower; it is Romney has gone up.  His support seems to be at the expense of Gingrich and Paul.  Also, Nate said the % of evangelicals polled this time was 41% versus 48% the last time.  Much more appropriate number.

So long as this drags out i'm happy.  :)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
"Sweet Jesus, who are these people." (2.00 / 4)
These are people who have had Holy Ghost Enemas.

[ Parent ]
Opus Dei (2.00 / 7)
Gingrich was converted to Catholicism by Father C John McCloskey, a member of the Opus Dei order to which Santorum also apparently has self-proclaimed ties.  These are "special" Catholics who might not be well received by the general congregation, who probably know about this stuff.

Santorum appeared in 2002 in Rome at a high-profile congress commemorating the birth of Opus Dei's founder Josemaria Escriva de Balaguer, who was supportive of Franco in his native Spain and Pinochet in Argentina:

In contemporary Western debates, this idea of unity between faith and political allegiance often puts Opus Dei-inspired politicians on the right.

Santorum was a forceful champion of this view. He told NCR that a distinction between private religious conviction and public responsibility, enshrined in John Kennedy's famous speech in 1960 saying he would not take orders from the Catholic church if elected president, has caused "much harm in America."

"All of us have heard people say, 'I privately am against abortion, homosexual marriage, stem cell research, cloning. But who am I to decide that it's not right for somebody else?' It sounds good," Santourm said. "But it is the corruption of freedom of conscience."

Santorum told NCR that he regards George W. Bush as "the first Catholic president of the United States."

"From economic issues focusing on the poor and social justice, to issues of human life, George Bush is there," he said. "He has every right to say, 'I'm where you are if you're a believing Catholic.' "

John L Allen Jr - Opus Dei prestige on display at centenary event National Catholic Reporter 18 Jan 02

Get it?  Kennedy wasn't Catholic and Bush was.  Santorum is a dangerous thinker and I can understand why many Catholics give him a wide berth, but evangelicals eat this stuff up.  For more on Opus Dei consult the Internet and put on your waders.  

[ Parent ]
Sorry... (2.00 / 6)
...Pinochet in Chile...  Got my South American juntas mixed up.

[ Parent ]
Got my South American juntas mixed up. (2.00 / 6)
All too easy to do.

[ Parent ]
"...it is the corruption of freedom of conscience."" (2.00 / 6)
"...it is the corruption of freedom of conscience.""

The corruption of freedom of conscience.

Now, where else do we find such views?

A Muslim cleric Wednesday said Egypt will be ruled by Sharia law and eventually the United States - and the whole world - will fall to radical Islam. In a heated interview with Fox News' Sean Hannity, Sheik Anjem Choudary also called for the destruction of Israel, saying the Jewish state needs to be "repelled" for what it has done to Muslims.

"Sharia will come and it will remove the corruption of democracy, and freedom, and all of your exploitation," Choudary said. "You are worried because you know Islam is coming to your backyard."

All they disagree on is a matter of cannon (see what I did there?).

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
[M]y God [is] bigger than [yours.] My God is a real God, (2.00 / 7)
[ Parent ]
I want some of his hallucinogens. (2.00 / 6)
Mmmm, the joy of being hopelessly insane.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
I am.. you are... we are... (2.00 / 1)

But... You Never Blow Y'r Trip Forever.

[ Parent ]
You see how Obama divides America? n/t (2.00 / 6)

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
R. Sanctimoron is not the Second Coming of G.W. Bush (2.00 / 9)
Santorum can't seem to help himself.  And while part of me hopes he can keep the lid on the worst of the crazy long enough to win the nomination part of me fears him ::cough::George W. Bush::cough:: while still another part is sorry to see what may be the death of the Republican Party.

I understand your trepidation, but I do not think that ex-Senator Sanctimoron has a prayer of convincing enough of the public to vote for him that he achieves a majority in the Electoral College (assuming that he wins the Republican nomination).

G.W. Bush was able to convince enough people in enough States to win that he was a "Compassionate Conservative" and a "Reformer with Results." He adopted a bit of an environmentalist persona by saying that he was in favor of limits on carbon-dioxide emissions.  Enough people saw him as the kind of guy you would enjoy having a beer with to make a difference.

Al Gore made GWB's job easier by coming across as a stiff, as a phony (remember Earth Tones?), as an audioanimatronic candidate (Romney shares the same affliction), and as priggish (remember the Lockbox, and the sighing during one of the debates with Dubya?).

John Kerry also had something of that audioanimatronic quality, though not as much as Al Gore.  (Kerry did not help himself in the authenticity department by going hunting in Southeast Ohio in duds that looked like they had just come off the rack at the nearest Eddie Bauer's or Cabela's.)

Rick Sanctimoron does not at all come across as the guy that you'd like to sit down and share some suds with.

Rather, he comes across as the Eighth Grade Hall Monitor at Saint Aloysius Catholic School, ready to turn you in to Sister Mary Moses of the Burning Bush for having been seen entering a movie theatre that was showing a film that had been rated Condemned by the Legion of Decency, or for copping a smoke in the Boys' Lavatory during Recess.

Barack Obama, on the other hand, comes across as the kind of guy (2.00 / 9)
that most people (other than incurable racists) would enjoy having a couple of brewskis with.  

[ Parent ]
He's supposed to be both low key (2.00 / 9)
and pretty funny in person.  

More importantly, a friend who is currently serving as a fellow on the Council of Economic Advisers says he comes off even sharper in meetings than he does in speeches and interviews.  She describes him as an intensely incisive listener who hangs back and then interjects the sharpest questions that keep the debate on track and uncover salient points and weaknesses on all sides.

What this seems to confirm is the picture that Fallows drew in his Atlantic profile: http://www.theatlantic.com/mag...

Basically, Obama didn't trust himself enough and deferred too much to his economic team (Summers et al) in his first term but has been displaying more and more confidence positioning him to be [even] more effective in his second term.  It's a great read.  

But if Obama's flaw is that he was too much a student in his first term, it's also a strength that Santorum will nbever have, and one that is critical in a President.  No one enters that job with experience in it.  We need someone who can learn, and learn both fast and well.  Someone both quick and methodical.  For all that we deride Clintonian triangulation, look at how much more sophisticated Clinton became by his third year in office.  He, too, actively learned how to do the job more effectively, even if we didn't always agree with what he chose to do in the process.  But the point is, Santorum's world-view, rooted in ossified and defensive moral absolutes, suggest that whatever native intelligence and intellectual experience he possesses is fundamentally crippled.  If Romney will do anything according to the political winds, Santorum is the polar opposite.  He's the saint whose perseverance testifies to an unswerving faith in a transcendent truth.  He may indeed be more qualified for pope than pres.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Points well-taken. (2.00 / 7)
At some point soon I want to play with the GE map.  OFA sent out a "road map to victory" a few weeks ago outlining the various ways POTUS can win.  Interestingly, all four scenarios have FL ands IN red.  They all also assume the Kerry states stay blue as a baseline.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
have fun. :) (2.00 / 8)
i've been at it for weeks.  lulz


Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

[ Parent ]
Duude! (2.00 / 7)
Why you holding out?!  That's cool.

Looks like a tough row to hoe for the GOP.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
If (google Santorum) wins in Michigan I will be... (2.00 / 7)
... busting Gandalf's chops. You can count on that.  

Just because they are posting on a progressive site doesn't make them progressives. - John Allen

I believe we have three Michiganders masquerading as (2.00 / 7)
Moose.  Save a bit for the other two.  :)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Yes yes yes (2.00 / 7)
I will be inordinately jealous if John's chops are busted and mine remain intact.  I will expect some very serious chop busting to come my direction or I will, as a confirmed attention whore, feel slighted and dejected.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Hell, I'm thinking about voting for Ricky in the primary. (2.00 / 8)
I would love to see Romney humbled in Michigan.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
Dunno (2.00 / 8)
If Santorum is the nominee, manages to discipline himself about talking about manufacturing instead of contraception, and Europe collapses economically...

This guy wants to defund amniocentesis as he thinks its all about health care providers encouraging abortion for the sake of avoiding health care costs of the disabled.  He also wants insurance companies to stop paying for IUDs, among the safest contraceptives used by many married women, far safer than the pill, as he thinks they are abortofascients because they prevent the implantation of zygotes, which he considers to be people.  He also thinks that religious liberty is about following the laws of the god he believes gave us our rights.

I can't be anywhere near facilitating his "Handmaid's Tale" vision of America, even if it would require a perfect storm.  

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Is there enough out there, though, to campaign against? (2.00 / 6)
As in has Santorum already made his rhetorical bed?  And, honest truth, I don't think the guy can stop himself.

Slightly OT but his campaign also has to keep backtracking on stuff they say.  Santorum's campaign spox "misspoke" when she said POTUS had "radical Islamist policies."  She apparently meant "environmental."  I can see mixing up Islamist and environmental.  Suuuuuure!

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Yeah (2.00 / 7)
apparently when he was talking about Obama's "phony theology" he was referring to radical environmentalism that positions "man" to "serve the earth" as opposed to being "responsible stewards."

First of all, this is way too dog whistly for me to think it unintentional.  Then the walk-backs make him seem a victim of the media (picking up on Newt's game, which is basically a war on the freedom of the press).  Secondly, what does he think environmentalists are about when they talk about "sustainability?"  It's not just sustainability of the environment, it's sustainability of the bio-sphere, which is sustainability of the species.  Yes, there is an anti-humanist, or at least anti-anthropocentrist current within environmental thinking.  But most environmentalists are humanists.  They are interested in making sure that we don't undermine our own ability to live on Earth.  To paraphrase one of the progenitors of the Gaia movement, "Gaia's a tough bitch, she'll be able to repair herself in the end, but she may need to outlast us to do so."  

Why aren't people calling him out on his straw man arguments.  Demand quotes from him.  Where does Obama suggest we should serve the earth and subordinate humanity to the health of the environment?  Where does he say that Government should take over the economy?  Where has he actually declared war on the Catholic Church?  I mean, when he starts suggesting that it should give up its tax exemptions and when he starts taking over Church property through eminent domain and when he starts locking up bishops who disagree with him, then fine.  Until then, Rick, put up or stop lying.  

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
And now he's pissed off the Dutch... (2.00 / 7)
"Rick Santorum Thinks He Knows the Netherlands: Murder of the Elderly on a Grand Scale" is Saturday's headline in the daily newspaper NRC Handelsblad.

"Rick Santorum is an arch conservative. The most conservative of all candidates in the Republican primaries. He loathes abortion and euthanasia. So now he loathes the Netherlands. Because in the Netherlands we kill the elderly like there's no tomorrow," reads the story, according to a translation provided by BuzzFeed's Low Country correspondent, and author of a Dutch blog on American politics, Bertine Moenaff. The story quotes Santorum, before concluding: "This man is really imaginative. It would be a laughing matter, if he weren't in the race for the Republican nomination to take on Barack Obama in the race for the presidency of the most powerful country in the world.

Santorum said in an interview with social conservative leader James Dobson earlier this month that euthanasia makes up "ten percent of all deaths, and half of those people are euthanized involuntarily, because they are old or sick. And so elderly people in the Netherlands don't go into a hospital. They go to other country." "  http://www.buzzfeed.com/buzzfe...  

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
"Great" minds and all of that... (2.00 / 7)
On Monday, America Live host Megyn Kelly invited a panel made up of radio host David Webb and Gotham Ghostwriters president / Democratic strategist Dan Gerstein onto the show to discuss candidate Rick Santorum's recent comments concerning Barack Obama's values and faith.


Webb, for one, believes that, in context, Santorum had been referring to the President's "belief system" rather than his religion. But "what he doesn't do well," Webb pointed out, "is stop writing ads for the Obama campaign." Santorum was merely playing to the Christian crowd, he continued explaining, "and that's dumb, Megyn. You've got to focus on the Obama administration's jobs record, on its economy record. Focus on those things and stop playing to the crowd."

Gerstein, meanwhile, feels Santorum's "phony theology" comment amounts to a personal attack because - whether or not it was meant in a religious context - it sought to question the President's motivations. Both panelists agreed that Santorum and the rest of the GOP field would do well to avoid attacking the President personally because it'll result in alienating Independent voters come the general election. The key strategy? Again: going after Obama's record, particularly where jobs are concerned. http://www.mediaite.com/tv/meg...  

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Which is why I posted a comment yesterday (2.00 / 8)
saying the main reason I was uncertain about whether to do this was the old saw, "Be careful what you wish for..."

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
Noted (2.00 / 6)
It's just that I share the impulse.  

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
If he actually won the nomination. (2.00 / 5)
I don't know how you would be able to sleep at night.

It seems like a good idea until you remember he's running against one of the most incompetent and disliked favorites ever. If Ricardo gets a bigger platform like the G.E. to spew his nonsense I might hurl.

Still, if he wins Michigan you guys aren't safe from spacemanspiff.  

Just because they are posting on a progressive site doesn't make them progressives. - John Allen

[ Parent ]
BTW (2.00 / 9)
Will there EVER be a concerted public relations campaign on behalf of the ACA?  If the recovery holds and we could get opposition to repeal below %50, which shouldn't be difficult as opposition is currently around %53, this thing will be much closer to being in the proverbial bag.  I think it's a mistake to leave it to Obama to do in the course of his re-elect effort.  As long as we have these odious super-pacs, let's get one promoting the benefits and refuting the slanders.  It's already very very late to start, but hopefully not too late...

The future is unwritten

Great minds (2.00 / 9)
I've been thinking about the same thing for a few months now. We need really educate the public on the benefits in the ACA. We need to push back against the lie that it will explode the deficit. We need to trumpet the good parts that have already gone into effect and point out everything that will become effective over the next two years. I'd love to see a super pac formed solely for this purpose.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
ya think? (1.83 / 6)
...what may be the death of the Republican Party.

fogiv sed:

03/24/10:  http://www.motleymoose.com/sho...

Republican leaders and officials have actively courted this nutzoid element with their fear-mongering, coded racism, talk of tyranny, treason, and Armageddon.  The GOP must face down this monster they have helped make, before they are lost forever, mired in the fever swamp.

12/08/09: http://www.motleymoose.com/sho...

The Republican Roadster, the once-feared electoral muscle-car of the 80's and 90's isn't exactly 'track ready' these days -- if being lapped by barely literate (judging from the signs) old white people atop an armada of Rascal Scooters is any indication.  The Party of Lincoln and Roosevelt, of Ike and AuH20, is long gone.  Has today's GOP taken the Teabagger ramp, launching in a fatal arc over the shark?

04/14/09: http://www.motleymoose.com/sho...

The political party that barfed up the hairball that is Sarah Palin, helmed by Michael Keepin' it Real Steele--or depending on the time of day--Rush Limbaugh (the talk radio equivalent of government cheese) has bought the proverbial farm. Dead. Teets up, like Colonel Sanders and Ayn Rand.


this for you:


Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

I don't know how to read this (2.00 / 4)
but it scares me...

...and I like it.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Translates... (2.00 / 4)
You've been Rick-rolled:

Never gonna give you up
Never gonna let you down
Never gonna run around and desert you
Never gonna make you cry
Never gonna say goodbye
Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you.

Rick Astley

[ Parent ]
Now I know what scared me (2.00 / 4)
Fog is gay for the GOP.

Is there anyway we can get them to hire Rick Astley for their convention?

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Frakin' fog ~ now I have that song stuck in my head. (2.00 / 6)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Now I know what scared me (2.00 / 2)
Fog is gay for the GOP.

Is there anyway we can get them to hire Rick Astley for their convention?

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Maybe if you were around more often I wouldn't have to (2.00 / 3)
repeat you.

(Oh yes I di'id.)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
P.S. I love that Y U No guy on Twitter. (2.00 / 3)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
;) (2.00 / 2)
will try harder, haps.  i swearz.

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

[ Parent ]
Uh-huh... (2.00 / 3)
Shaun said:

The debate over the future of the Republican Party has hardly progressed beyond the desperate and defamatory sloganeering of the McCain campaign in its closing weeks.  Apart from the ongoing divide over the perils of Palinism the ideological battle for the 'soul' of the Republican party is apparently over and it was aptly summarised recently by Jonathan Rauch of the National Journal:

The history of the modern Republican Party in one sentence: Barry Goldwater and Nelson Rockefeller got into an argument and George Wallace won.

Jonathan Rauch - It's George Wallace's GOP Now National Journal 27 Feb 10

Instead of resetting the Republican platform to core conservative values they have allowed themselves to be co-opted into settling for a national agenda which appeals to an increasingly incoherent, marginalised and aggrieved minority.

The Incredible Shrinking Party Motley Moose 27 Feb 10

Summing up:

They are terrified of militant grass-roots primary challenges from a newly empowered, angry minority within their own party which takes its cues from arguably xenophobic and racist shock radio.  They are desperately trying to hold together the increasingly shaky coalition of their lower-to-middle class 'values voters' constituencies, on the one hand, and their elite corporate campaign contributors whom have been wringing out enormous profits and lavish bonuses at the expense of the former for decades.  They are without leadership and their demographic prospects are discouraging.  Their moderates, including those whom might actually get elected, are either caving to the militant rhetoric or wisely staying out of the fray while sacrificing essential media exposure.  

The Incredible Shrinking Party Motley Moose 27 Feb 10

Heh.  It's a long trip to nowhere for them at the moment.  Rope-a-dope.

[ Parent ]
Yeah well, I'm cuter. :P (2.00 / 3)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
No Contest (2.00 / 2)
About anything.

[ Parent ]
cuter than moi?!? (2.00 / 1)
dat truf.  i think even my wife would agree w/ that assessment.

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

[ Parent ]
Poor Mitt can't get anyone excited ... (2.00 / 6)
Today's single campaign event was also notable for what it lacked -- many of the hallmarks of a traditional Romney campaign stop. There was no warm up music, no mention of "America the Beautiful," a minimal amount of signs, and a noticeable lack of energy from the crowd; People applauded only sparingly as Romney defended his fiscal conservatism and lauded the entrepreneurial spirit of the people of Ohio. http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com...  

This is also a campaign stop where Romney laid into Santorum for voting to raise the debt ceiling while standing next to Rob Portman who ... yes, you guessed it ... voted to raise the debt ceiling.

And the Romney campaign is sending out Tim Pawlenty among others to stump for their candidate.  Woohoo!  A fun time there.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

Fwiw (2.00 / 4)
Aaron Blake @FixAaron

Romney spent nearly $19 million in January. Combined with his super PAC, they spent more than $32 million.
Retweeted by Rachel Weiner

The Romney campaign has $7 mill cash on hand.  He raised $6.5 mill in January to use in the primary, zero in seven figures donations.  Gingrich, if anyone cares, raised just under $11 mill in January ~ ten of which came from Adelson.  Yet he's staying in the race 'cause fiscal conservatism y'all ... or something.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
... (2.00 / 4)
Indecision @indecision

I wonder how (money) it is that Mitt Romney (money) has managed to (money) close the gap (money) in Michi(money)gan? bit.ly/Ay30Yb

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Karma's a bitch, ain't it, Mitt? (2.00 / 5)
Sam Stein @samsteinhp

to put that last # in perspective, Romney camp spent $19,019,342.53 during all of the last 3 months of 2011 combined

Gloat about outspending Kennedy while driving him to take out another mortgage and now you have to spend bucketloads and people still don't like you.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Not to beat a dead horse... (2.00 / 5)
Nate Silver @fivethirtyeight

Romney's (-)$12.2M cashflow in the worst January figure I can find in the FEC database. Bush was (-)$10.8M in 2000.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
It looks like that dude in the W.H. will have a lot more spare change... (2.00 / 5)
... than Mittens. Payback is a bitch and I can't wait to see him whining about "being outspent 8:1 yet we are only 10 points back!" in some swing state.  

Just because they are posting on a progressive site doesn't make them progressives. - John Allen

[ Parent ]
In related news (2.00 / 6)
Steve Forbes explains how and why Ben Bernanke is a "Supreme Socialist"!!!


Be afraid.  Be very very afraid.  

At this rate, we could all end up suffering just like...Steve Forbes???

The future is unwritten

"Ben Bernanke" ~ the guy even Tim Geithner is glad he isn't. (2.00 / 4)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
And isn't Forbes supposed (2.00 / 3)
to be one of the GOP's adults?

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
More questions I want St. Rick and the American Church Militant to answer (2.00 / 6)
Following the logic of the Hyde Amendment, which prohibits the use of federal funding for abortion services, does your concept of "religious liberty" mean that all deployments of federal tax dollars be subject to approval by the Catholic Church?  

Does this effectively put an end to the death penalty, or would you privatize it?  

What about military actions?  Many on the left were very upset that their tax dollars were committed to prosecuting wars in the past decade, yet they were not exempt from paying taxes.  If the Catholic Church opposed a military action, would it need to be funded privately in order to preserve the religious liberty of Catholics?  

Which other religious groups would have the power, under your administration, to veto the use of tax dollars for purposes that run counter to their beliefs?

The future is unwritten

Maybe Ricky will get asked during Wednesday's debate. (2.00 / 6)
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha ... snort ...Hahahahahahahahaha

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Sigh (2.00 / 4)
Once again Charles Pierce sums it up:

The Republican party is about a half-step away from handing its presidential nomination to an out-and-out religious fanatic whose views, as expressed to allegedly evolved primates on the campaign trail, are not dissimilar to those that some people listen to on their short-wave sets in survivalist camps in upper Michigan, or those that other people hear transmitted to them from St. Michael The Archangel through the fillings in their teeth.

There were a number of reasons why the people of the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania decided six years ago that they no longer wanted to be represented in the U.S. Senate by fetus-fondling Torquemada. Over the past few days, we have seen only a few of them.

Charles P Pierce Theology for Dummies Esquire 21 Feb 12

I hope he's writing a book.

[ Parent ]
Sure, but I'd rather read yours n/t (2.00 / 4)

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Shucks (2.00 / 3)
Coming from you that's a nice compliment, Doc.

[ Parent ]
trufact! (2.00 / 2)

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

[ Parent ]
Heh (2.00 / 4)
Thanks, Fogiv.  I'm actually "writing" a table-top naval wargame on the early war years in the Pacific which I hope to someday expand to cover the whole era of steel-built navies from Victorian days to 1945.  It consumes all of my time not spent working, blogging, eating or sleeping.  

The amount of original source material now available on the Internet is truly impressive, it has become the greatest library the world has ever known; I am currently parsing through all the after-action reports for salient clues and trying to teach myself integral calculus so I can replicate some of the operational research which pioneered the influence of mathematics on tactical doctrine.  It amazes me the vast cognitive resources which were mobilised for that war:

Other work by the [Coastal Command's Operational Research Section] indicated that on average if the trigger depth of aerial-delivered depth charges were changed from 100 feet to 25 feet, the kill ratios would go up. The reason was that if a U-boat saw an aircraft only shortly before it arrived over the target then at 100 feet the charges would do no damage (because the U-boat wouldn't have had time to descend as far as 100 feet), and if it saw the aircraft a long way from the target it had time to alter course under water so the chances of it being within the 20-foot kill zone of the charges was small.

It was more efficient to attack those submarines close to the surface when the targets' locations were better known than to attempt their destruction at greater depths when their positions could only be guessed. Before the change of settings from 100 feet to 25 feet, 1% of submerged U-boats were sunk and 14% damaged. After the change, 7% were sunk and 11% damaged.

Operational Research: Second World War Wikipedia

It's all about doctrine, baby; the force multiplier of technology.  Nerdy stuff, to be sure, but my passion.  Rather than take a traditional determinative approach, using ballistics formulae for assessing armour penetration at various ranges and so forth, I am trying to emulate operational research analysis to provide a predictive model which will make for a playable but accurate game which teaches faithfully the lessons of naval combat.  And provide a plausible excuse for pushing little model warships around on a ping-pong table and roll dice.  My idea of fun.

[ Parent ]
If you only knew (2.00 / 4)
how many hours a week I spend looking at guitars and music gear online and talking about it on blogs...

I could have written 4 novels and published 6 articles in the past two years.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
Well... (2.00 / 3)
Then write about it.  I'm guessing with your background you could produce a fascinating book or storyboard for a documentary and we always work at our best with our passions engaged.  Maybe you and Fogiv should do a reality TV series touring the country and tracing the evolution of the guitar as an icon of popular culture; seeking out rare and exceptional instruments and their idiosyncratic owners.

I will read or watch anything if it is done well; I read the New Yorker, every issue, and there is well written stuff in there about things I am not remotely interested in at face value.

[ Parent ]
I've Found... (2.00 / 3)
That when engaged in some concrete, goal-oriented activity around a passionate interest it obliges one to actively seek out answers to things otherwise casually assumed or guessed at, to fill in the blanks; it's a lot of mundane effort but the end result often takes one into new realms, reassessment and, sometimes, revelations which indelibly alter one's relationship with cherished pastimes.  It's our gift, I reckon.  

I've often wondered what my life's purpose was, beyond one's universal relationship with God and practice of wholesome relationships.  I now find it has been overlooked among my modest hobbies and pastimes.  For me it is about honouring the fallen of past conflicts; understanding their circumstances, preserving their legacy and noting the hard-won lessons of their service lest we learn them anew at unnecessary cost.

[ Parent ]
very very VERY fun fact (2.00 / 5)
Don't know why I didn't know this one, but not only was Abraham Lincoln the first president to sign a federal income tax into law, but it was a progressive income tax that didn't distinguish between earned income and capital gains.

Yep.  Abe Lincoln invented US Federal Income Tax.  THE COMMMMMIE!!!


The future is unwritten

Ruh roh, Romney ... (2.00 / 5)
In Michigan:

"If you just cut, if all you're thinking about doing is cutting spending, as you cut spending you'll slow down the economy," Romney said. "So you have to, at the same time, create pro-growth tax policies."

NBC, which reported the above quote, reached out to small government group Club For Growth, whose vice president for government affairs, Andy Roth, was unsurprisingly upset.

"It's hogwash," he said. "It confirms yet again that Romney is not a limited government conservative."

The ads just write themselves.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

yeah, santorum is more their speed (2.00 / 5)
WaPo headline from about 15 minutes ago:

Santorum: Obama is ill-intentioned power grabber who undermines churches, promotes false fears


good luck with that, prick.

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey

[ Parent ]
Godwin, anyone? (2.00 / 5)
-Speaking Sunday at First Redeemer Church in Cumming, Ga., Santorum said people who shrug off troubling signs about Obama are like those Americans who ignored the growing fascist menace in Europe before World War II. "Your country needs you. It's not as clear a challenge," Santorum said. "Obviously, World War II was pretty obvious. At some point, they knew. But remember, the Greatest Generation, for a year and a half, sat on the sidelines while Europe was under darkness, where our closest ally, Britain, was being bombed and leveled, while Japan was spreading its cancer all throughout Southeast Asia. America sat from 1940, when France fell, to December of '41, and did almost nothing.

"Why? Because we're a hopeful people. We think, 'Well, you know, he'll get better. You know, he's a nice guy. I mean, it won't be near as bad as what we think. This will be OK.' Oh yeah, maybe he's not the best guy, and after a while, you found out things about this guy over in Europe, and he's not so good of a guy after all."

"He"? Who is this "He" that the President is being compared to?

Asked by a reporter Monday if he was comparing Obama to Hitler, Santorum said "No, of course not."

No! Of course not! I meant Vincent van Gogh!

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
Can I ask who ever, even early on, ever described Hitler as a "nice guy?" (2.00 / 5)
Charismatic, sure.  Compelling, indeed.  But nice?   I'm sure someone did.  But it was never exactly part of his appeal.

And just so there is no confusion here, I am firmly opposed to all things Hitler.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
His mother? (2.00 / 3)
Eh, maybe not.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
Or the French woman who gave him a son? (2.00 / 3)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Actually, (2.00 / 5)
pro-growth tax policies could refer to tax cuts. They believe tax cuts increase revenue.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
Austerity and Tax Cuts... (2.00 / 3)
What could possibly go wrong?

[ Parent ]
Oh well. (2.00 / 3)
Now that I read it more carefully I get it.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]

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