History of Man: A Punctuatedly Evolutional Open Thread

by: Chris Blask

Thu Mar 15, 2012 at 21:42:09 PM EDT



We digressed into the evolution of mankind and our use of artifacts and theologies from pre-human times in the last open thread, so in this one we will start on that and see where we end up (educational funding?).

I'll start with an example of how far we have evolved since we separated from our common ancestor with chimpanzee's seven or ten million years ago:

Chris Blask :: History of Man: A Punctuatedly Evolutional Open Thread
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So far we've traveled (2.00 / 3)
But the road has been convoluted, often rocky or muddy or enveloped in blinding dust, doubling back upon itself, veering into blind canyons and dead ends, losing itself in a tangle of competing crossroads.  With history's perspective (and selective editing) we can design narratives of progressive enlightenment as our species journeys through time, and overall convincingly defend that thesis.

And yet................

And yet every steppingstone on that journey has been bedded in some greater or lesser darkness at its base.  The McGuffin that sparked this thread, the invention of weaponry, is the perfect example of that, of the yin and yang inextricably bound into every great (or lesser) leap forward.

So far we've come, so far we have yet to go; so far.... and my mind leaps to this, a journey's end, so far from its beginnings; a tool of man invented, made, used, and ultimately betrayed by man; the betrayers themselves used and abused by other men; and no amount of washing will eradicate the stain, from hand or land:



If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done subjunctively.


The road has been built. (2.00 / 1)
That is the lesson. Building a road has been an iterative challenge in our history and present. In each case you start with two points and what lies between is what it is. Usually that can be summed up in one word:

"Uncharted"

Theology imposes the idea that there is a road there, if we could only find it. Personally that looks like what it is: wishful thinking to allow folks to get through the day. The reality is that there is no road because we haven't built one, yet.

The universe doesn't have to make it easy to make a road. There isn't a guiding hand behind it that lays things out for our convenience. The very idea of "road" is something of our own creation, and the implementation of that idea comes down to our own abilities.

In recent time (a few million years) we have had to invent invention, to imagine imagination, and from there create everything else. "Fairness". "Love". Thought, intent, right, wrong - these are all things of our own making.

Rather than see and bemoan the dead-ends and failed attempts, we should stand in stunned amazement that we have accomplished so much with so little.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
The video is a little over-the-top for me. (2.00 / 1)
Never cared for propaganda movies. Not even ones from my own side. They tend to cloud people's judgement.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

Not for me (2.00 / 6)
people need to have clear reminders of what has been accomplished.

Given all the right wing racist/sexist noise we get daily from the Teapublicans and their mouthpieces in the media - this works.


"If you're in a coalition and you're comfortable, you know it's not a broad enough coalition"

Bernice Johnson Reagon


[ Parent ]
I'm with Denise (2.00 / 5)
I'm half way through - and this documentary style approach appeals to our intelligence and knowledge of facts. Sure, it's slanted in some ways. But it's not emotive propaganda: cheering crowds, hugging babies, soldiers and flags. It's a real account.

John's characterisation of it made me think the program would be campaign fluff. That's seriously misleading.  

The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'


[ Parent ]
I mostly like it. (2.00 / 5)
It is a good piece and it needs to be said. Folks don't know, and Education is Good.

To John's point, it is meant for believers (the base). There is one point where the Angelic Strings are a bit much for me - and even for such a piece I would have avoided using them - but I understand what the producer was after.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
I didn't watch the whole thing before I posted that comment. (2.00 / 4)
It starts with cheering crowds and waving flags. I watched a few seconds of that and then clicked through at various points and saw more cheering crowds, hugging babies, soldiers, and flags. Those scenes and the music were what prompted my "over-the-top" comment.

Now that I've watched the whole video, I can see that it isn't as bad as I'd thought. The message they are spreading is an important one. However, I still think this particular video qualifies as propaganda. Not because of an attempt to spread disinformation or "the big lie." It's more about the tone of the narration and the music.  

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.


[ Parent ]
"Pure Marketing" at the very least. (2.00 / 4)
Oh yeah, it's Pomp and Circumstance all day long. A bit painful from an objective perspective.

I've watched quite a few WWII propaganda films in recent months. Many British and American and a documentary or two about Nazi propaganda. It is certainly in the eye of the beholder to some extent, but there is propaganda and then there is propaganda...

From a detached perspective, propaganda tells a lot about a culture. Nazi culture was based on a eugenics philosophy and their propaganda unabashedly pushed that point. It looks insane to anyone (well, sane), which is a good place to start when judging the culture.

British propaganda in WWII focused on the strength of the British people and dastardliness of Germans. American propaganda focused on equality and justice.

Some today might be surprised or cynical about the racial equality message embedded in US WWII propaganda given our failures on the topic up to and including that period. But propaganda by nature exemplifies goals more than reality. Even Hitler did not have the power to actually deliver all he promised in his propaganda, either in stability for his people or victory against his opponents.

But Nazi propaganda did not pretend to be pushing any goal other than the racist, totalitarian ideology that it promoted. American propaganda may not reflect the achieved reality in all cases, but it reflects the goals that inspire us. July 4th Parade as it may be, the propaganda we aspire to be like contains a set of goals that I believe are more correct in many ways than most cultures in history have sought after.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
Successful rhetorical efforts often (2.00 / 7)
depend in part upon a strong emotional appeal.

The Greeks broke kairos down to 3 appeals:

ethos - creation of credibility/authority of the messenger and his ability to connect with his audience

logos - the logical force and structure of the argument

pathos - the emotional appeal that aids persuasion and moves toward consensus and action

It's pretty remarkable how this piece engages all three.  Given 20th century history and the great cults of personality that depended upon ginning up hatred and that led to massive atrocity, many of us are particularly on guard regarding sweeping emotional appeals.  For damn good reason.  And the aesthetics aren't exactly subtle.  But if it helps energize the base, aids fundraising and volunteer recruitment, and helps centrists consider an alternative perspective that stands in opposition to the narratives of the right and their consciously misleading propaganda, then I am all for it.  And I think this piece has a chance to set that tone and deliver important facts.

The future is unwritten


[ Parent ]
I think you're misusing the term propaganda (2.00 / 3)
To my mind, propaganda implies lies - about military victories or demonising enemies. This is definitely a slanted campaigning video which focuses on the Dem upside. It's sins against truth are sins of omission rather than commission

The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'

[ Parent ]
I agree with wiki on this: (2.00 / 5)
While the term propaganda has acquired a strongly negative connotation by association with its most manipulative and jingoistic examples, propaganda in its original sense was neutral, and could refer to uses that were generally benign or innocuous, such as public health recommendations, signs encouraging citizens to participate in a census or election, or messages encouraging persons to report crimes to the police, among others.

It isn't a negative word itself - and has been used openly in living memory without rancor.

"Marketing" is probably a more modernly accepted word (though that is literally incorrect, "advertising" is closer)  

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
I'm an old-timer (2.00 / 6)
Language evolves and I don't always evolve with it. I've never thought of propaganda as a totally negative word. In its less offensive variation I think of it as PR.  

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
We've got a ways to go. (2.00 / 5)
We need another 12 years of Democratic presidents to secure the Supreme Court. I believe that is the number 1 issue. There are a heck of a lot of important issues, but that one is critical. We also need to extricate ourselves from one war and avoid another. I'm not all that concerned about the economy. It will heal itself, eventually.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

The Dems need to sell me on those last eight years. (2.00 / 1)
I'm intrinsically against decades of either party in power uninterrupted, though at this point it seems unlikely that the GOP will be sober enough by 2016 to convince me.

2012 Obama has my vote without question. 2016 I (and, quite possibly, lots of others) will have to be won by one candidate or the other.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
I really do fear that the Republicans in the Senate (2.00 / 3)
will refuse to confirm Obama's SCOTUS appointments in his next term.

Which would leave us with a conservative-dominated court, whatever happens. It'll just be "temporarily" a seven- or eight-judge court.

Is that possible, or am I having a nightmare?

Every successful revolution puts on in time the robes of the tyrant it has deposed.--Barbara Tuchman  


[ Parent ]
Has anyone here read Stephen Pinker's New Book (2.00 / 2)
The Better Angels of Our Nature: A History of Violence and Humanity

The result is a salutary reality-check for the pessimism induced by looking back at the 20 century, and the self-absorption that treats terrorism as a threat even remotely comparable to those which faced the world in that era of global conflict. For most people, the world is a far ore peaceful place than it was for any of their ancestors - though as populations grow, the actual number of victims may multiply even though the percentages fall. Pinker's suggestion that the 20th century may not have been the bloodiest in history "when one adjusts for population size" discounts the dreadful toll from 20th-century conflicts given in a table: they approach 150 million.

His interpretation of the great historical decline in violence turns upon the two dominant themes in his understanding of human psychology. On the one hand, human nature is a package of evolved traits; on the other, humans have cognitive faculties that enable them to do things very different from what their psychology originally induced them to do. As he once put it, "if my genes don't like it, they can go jump in the lake"...

SNIP

Pinker himself is a model of restraint when it comes to the future. "Optimism requires a touch of arrogance," he remarks, nicely distancing himself from the current wave of conviction optimists who insist that the current order, liberal in economics and morality, will sustain us onwards and upwards. Here, perhaps, those great unacknowledged concentrations of unenlightenment hold him back. He declines to argue that because he finds the liberal order good, it must endure and continue its pacifying work. Instead, he commends a handful of better angels to us, in the hope that we will recognise what an immense achievement the reduction of violence has been, and see how to build upon it further.

Better Angels is itself a great liberal landmark. It has its conceits and is not as universal as it likes to think - but that's true of all great liberals. And few of them are as readable as this book, whose 700 pages of exposition almost turn themselves.

Marek Kohn: The Independent


I saw Pinker give a talk about this in London and he's a real Blaskite with his smarts and optimism. The thesis pretty awe inspiring; the decline of violence and cruelty has been a consistent thread in civilisation since Paleolithic times. Even the cruelty of Empires - where the state monopolised violence - meant that violent death reduced dramatically. Then, with the rise of civil society and civil liberties in the 18th century, violence dropped again precipitously, and led (in most countries) to the end of slavery, capital punishment and torture.

Even the violent deaths of World War II don't actually compare, proportionally, to other outbreaks of violence. The thirty year, or hundred year, wars in Europe over religion killed many more per capita. The Mongol invasion or Boxer rebellion were actually more bloody.

In international affairs, we're living in an age of unprecedented peace. War casualties have been particularly low since the end of the Cold War: the proxy wars of the West versus the USSR were quite savage in Asia, Latin America and Africa.

As for crime and personal violence, that is all basically good news, with a minor upwards blip in the 1960s for various reasons.

Short version:

In the paleolithic, your chances of meeting a violent death were around 30 percent. Now your chances of meeting a violent death (in the UK) are 0.003%

In the US it's around 0.005%

When we debate the prevalence of guns, that's all we're talking about


The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'


Pet Store Girl: "I like animals better than people, animals never fight." (2.00 / 4)
Death: "What are you talking about?? Animals fight all the time."

Pet Store Girl: "Not with nuclear arms. You can't hug a baby with nuclear arms."

Death: [Looks at girl, touches her, girl drops over dead,Death raises skeletal hand] "Check, please?"

Humanity did not invent violence, we invented its absense.

In the paleolithic, your chances of meeting a violent death were around 30 percent.

The remaining 70% probably broke out like this:

"Dying for lack of care as a juvenile: 20%
Starving to death while adult: 20%
Being left as too old and dying alone: 29%"

Now your chances of meeting a violent death (in the UK) are 0.003%

In the US it's around 0.005%

From the very first form of life, living has involved violence. This continued unabated until early homo started to change the model. In recent years (no I have not read the book, yet) we have sloped it down in general millennia to millennia. Today we have achieved a remove from violence that even our more recent ancestors (great-grandparents) would not recognize.

No, we are not descending into the mud from a High and Beautiful Place. We have risen from the mud, and now stand on dry ground we have built by hand.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
If it ain't college basketball it doesn't matter right now. (2.00 / 2)


"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

Is that the game with ice? (2.00 / 2)
Or is that the other one...?

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
I'm following Michigan State (2.00 / 4)
Draymond Green is da man. Started this tournament off with a triple double. The Spartans have an easier road to the Final 4 now that Mizzou is out.

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
I picked Florida to beat Mizzou ... (2.00 / 3)
And Michigan State.  :)

Picked f*cking Nore Dame over Duke.  I knew I hated ND for a reason.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
srsly?!? (2.00 / 2)
ragging on ND, today of all days?


Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey
 


[ Parent ]
I thought that was a school. (2.00 / 2)
Is there some sort of academic competition going on?

Why do I never know these things...?

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
Absofuckinglutely. :) (2.00 / 2)
Been cursing them out since they blew the South portion of my bracket.

(But I'm still in the top 92.3% of ESPN's bracket challenge.  If Florida loses I'll be cursing them out; have them in the Final Four.)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
asdf (2.00 / 1)


Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey
 


1963 (2.00 / 1)


Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey
 


[ Parent ]
OK, big brain, when did my ancestors come to North America? (2.00 / 1)
The 2010 series Prehistoric recreates US cities backwards over long periods of time. The "Denver" episode makes good arguments that people were smashing mammoth bones with stone axes 20,000 years ago. The extended idea is that we got here 22,000-25,000 years ago.

What is your informed view?  

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
we just don't know for sure (2.00 / 2)
i don't think i've seen the series you're referring to, but there's ample evidence (including now compelling archaeological data) that clovis (11,500 - 12,000 rcybp) wasn't first.  also, i think it likely there were waves of migration (perhaps of differing origin and route).  some of the most interesting stuff invloves mtDNA research.  check this out:

http://www.plosone.org/article...

he initial stage of the colonization process involved the divergence of Amerind ancestors from the East Central Asian gene pool (Figure 4A). Based on previous studies that included Asian mtDNA sequences, this divergence likely occurred prior to ≈50 kya [5], [6]. Our coding skyline plot (Figure 1) indicates that the divergence was followed by a period of gradual growth, during which the proto-Amerind population experienced a 7-fold increase from ≈640 to ≈4,400 females over ≈7,000 years, from ≈43-36 kya. The migrating founder population (Nef ≈640) was a small subset of the ancestral Asian population, as evidenced by the low levels of variation in New World populations relative to Asians (e.g. [3]) as well as the larger effective size of the ancestral Asian population [16]. Thus, divergence from the Asian gene pool was the time at which a severe population bottleneck occurred that reduced the genetic variation in Amerind populations. The lack of archaeological sites in Siberia and Beringia that date to ≈43-36 kya [34] suggests that this first stage of slow population growth left a light "footprint" on the landscape because of relatively rapid and continuous movement. Consistent with this hypothesis are the younger coalescent dates for modern Siberian populations relative to modern New World populations [15], [35], which indicate that the New World migrants passed through Siberia before other East Central Asian population(s) settled permanently in this region at a later date. Such relatively rapid and continuous movement would leave few archaeological sites, which have not yet been discovered due to the vast expanse and harsh conditions of Siberia and the current inundation of Beringia. Thus, an important prediction of the first stage of our model is that older archaeological sites dating to ≈43-36 kya await discovery in these regions.

so, I don't see your suggested dates, even at the outside 25k margin as outside the realm of strong possibility, even if the archaeological evidence for that is thus far scant.  to that end, if you or other moose could arrange to drain the pacific ocean long enough for me to get a good look at submerged coastlines from alaska to patagonia, i'd be greatly appreciative.  

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey
 


[ Parent ]
This feels about right. (2.00 / 2)
With an Out Of Africa migration somewhere between 70-50,000 years ago, populations could be expected to be reaching the corners of the Africa/Europe/Asia landmass in the 50-40,000 range. Small groups could have made the journey on purpose or by accident periodically before the landbridge of 15 kilo-years-ago let larger groups of the original population of Amerind-gene-bearing to make the trek and settle in thoroughly.

Interestingly, they would have passed through the Red Deer peoples' land on their way to Siberia. This (perhaps Neanderthal-variant) group would have been able to interbreed with the spreading Sapiens group, leaving genetic traces both in Chinese as well as Amerind descendants.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
hey (2.00 / 1)
thought you might find this interesting

http://www.lcoastpress.com/boo...

Earth is the best vacation place for advanced clowns. --Gary Busey
 


[ Parent ]
I'm kinda saying that most of the time. (2.00 / 1)
Security is as much sociology as technology. We get less security when all we think about is how to do it, and leave out the various "why"s involved.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
I'm more interested in what happened after the first migration (2.00 / 2)
than I am in when it happened. Mitochondrial DNA tests would seem to indicate that one or two small groups, possibly family clans, were the ancestors of almost all later populations. How did such small groups manage to explore and populate such a vast landmass in such a relatively short time span? What led to the physiological, cultural, and linguistic differences?  

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
What kind of sick son of a bitch... (2.00 / 4)
Witnesses said the gunman pulled up on a black scooter and began shooting at an area which serves as the drop-off point for the school's nursery- and primary-age children.

Sick, literally. That is about the most twisted thing I have heard. A kid going into a school and losing their minds is one thing, and adult driving up to one... I'm out of words for it.

Your point isn't, though: "but for guns, there would not be violence", is it?

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."


[ Parent ]
No, of course not (2.00 / 3)
Just venting frustration.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
When it is easier to buy a gun than it is to vote we have problems. (2.00 / 4)


"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
Trayvon (2.00 / 4)

So I have to wonder now when my Gbaby gets bigger will he be afraid to look like his Grampy so there's that.  

"I honor the place in you where Spirit lives
I honor the place in you which is
of Love, of Truth, of Light, of Peace,
when you are in that place in you,
and I am in that place in me,
then we are One."  Namaste Friends!


There is so much wrong with that story I don't know where to (2.00 / 5)
begin.  I've been meaning to write a diary about it but with everything else weighing on my mind (and getting an internal audit at work) I just haven't taken the time.

Something, though, is rotten in Sanford, FL.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
Trying hard not to lose it here (2.00 / 5)

Take this high def offering to 2:21 for George Zimmerman calling Trayvon Martin a fucking coon.

"I honor the place in you where Spirit lives
I honor the place in you which is
of Love, of Truth, of Light, of Peace,
when you are in that place in you,
and I am in that place in me,
then we are One."  Namaste Friends!


[ Parent ]
first of all let it go if you want. We don't mind. (2.00 / 4)
I was just reading about this in my time line.  I haven't listened yet ... not sure I need to be further pissed off right before heading to bed.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
It's all mixed up. (2.00 / 5)
Sadness, anger, outrage...

This is not a recession. It's a robbery.

[ Parent ]
How come the "fucking coon" comment hasn't been given more attention? (2.00 / 5)
I'll admit I didn't pick up on it at first, but on a second listen it's clearly audible.  Does this utterance carry any legal weight?  Doesn't it clearly suggest a predisposition to violence based on racial sentiment?  Isn't this the very definition of a hate crime?  

I'm sorry for getting so analytical about this.  No shortage of outrage here.  But the only thing that MIGHT be interpreted to suggest suspicious behavior (beyond, you know, walking while black) is that Martin ran.  Of course, this really only testifies to the young man's instincts.  But my point is that if he ran, how could shooting him be defensive?  Deadly force is hardly justified if someone is running in the opposite direction.  So the only thing that MIGHT be interpreted as suspicious directly undercuts the claim to the requirement of self-defense.

Seems eminently clear to anyone not a member of the Sanford PD that Zimmerman shot Martin because those scary black people "always get away" and not because of any imminent danger that would justify defensive deadly force.  Even with the "stand your ground" law, there seem to be clear grounds for a trial.

The future is unwritten


[ Parent ]
I just listened to the tape. (2.00 / 4)
There was no timestamp so I just came up on it ... damn near clear as day.

And now we know Trayvon was on the phone just before he started running; the girl he was talking to told him to run after he said he was being followed.  And he was running.  Presumably home.  After having done nothing but look "suspicious." And Zimmerman followed him ... got out of his car ... with a gun.  He said he was checking the streetsigns but if you're that worried about some suspicious character why do you get out of your car?

I'm sorry but Zimmerman was looking to catch Trayvon no matter what so another didn't get away.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
Interesting opinion piece on CNN.com (2.00 / 4)
In which the author argues, based on the language of the statute involved and what's known of the facts, that Trayvon had just as much legal right to waste Zimmerman and claim self-defense:

http://inamerica.blogs.cnn.com...

Of course, if a black kid kills a white guy, we all know how likely the cops and prosecutors would be to accept his story, right?

If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done subjunctively.


[ Parent ]
I've also read that it is harder to prosecute street gangs because of the law. (2.00 / 3)
But i guess no one cares if they blow each other away.

At least the state attorney has finally sent the case to a grand jury; they meet April 10th.  And the DOJ and FBI are investigating as well as the FDLE.  Maybe if Sanford PD had done more than the bare minimum ...

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
Two of the sponsors of the "stand your ground" bill (2.00 / 3)
think Zimmerman should be prosecuted.  (And Mother Jones is doing excellent work on this whole disaster):

http://m.motherjones.com/polit...

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
Sad shit. (2.00 / 1)
There is a petition worth signing put up by the family.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
And then we have this ... (2.00 / 2)
"We are taking a beating over this," said [Police Chief Bill] Lee, who defends the investigation. "This is all very unsettling. I'm sure if George Zimmerman had the opportunity to relive Sunday, Feb. 26, he'd probably do things differently. I'm sure Trayvon would, too."

Read more: http://www.esquire.com/blogs/p...

WTeverlivingF does that mean?!  What would Trayvon do differently?!  He went to the fucking store to get some Skittles and a goddamned can of iced tea!  Jesus fucking Christ, really?!  He didn't have to do any "differently" except maybe be born white 17 years earlier.  Lee shouldn't ever dare mention Trayvon Martin's name except in a courtroom defending his lame ass "investigation."

Just when I thought I couldn't get any madder.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


[ Parent ]
Well, be fair (2.00 / 2)
I mean, if the kid had groveled at Zimmerman's feet the instant he was accosted, kept repeating "Whatever you say, Mister, whatever you say," maybe taken a little healthy pistol-whipping without protest, why, I'm sure he'd be alive today.  So clearly the kid has to take some of the blame for being shot to death, right?

Right?

* spits *

If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done subjunctively.


[ Parent ]
Maybe he should have been packing some heat (2.00 / 2)
to shoot the guy tailing him...in justified self-defense.

The future is unwritten

[ Parent ]
I'm going to lighten up a bit ... (2.00 / 6)
Wherein POTUS impresses me again:

Stephon stood just a few feet away from Barack Obama. The president, busy shaking hands, looked right at him. "It was like he was waiting for me to say something," he said later.

So the 26-year-old Prince George's Community College student took his cue and spoke to President Obama in his first language: American Sign Language. "I am proud of you," Stephon signed. The president, almost involuntary, instinctively, immediately signed back.

"Thank you," Obama replied.

This is one of those moments that humanize the office of the presidency:

Dude apparently made a birther joke today, too, when the Irsh Prime Minister offered him proof of his Irish heritage.  I wish I was that cool.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


OMG (2.00 / 3)
That.............. was too cool for words, signed or spoken.

If it were done when 'tis done, then 'twere well it were done subjunctively.

[ Parent ]
Ten days 'til POTUS is in Vermont. (2.00 / 4)
Got my invitation and my Obama 2012 shirt.

Just read they can't find a place big enough to hold all the folks who want to see him.  Suckers!  Gotta strike early.  :)

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette


Pics! (2.00 / 1)
Enjoy! I'd love to take my kids to see him talk again.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
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