Four Newtowns a day, a World Trade Center a month

by: Im a frayed knot

Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 17:13:54 PM EST

An article in Science Daily caught my attention:
With more than 30,000 Americans killed by guns each year -- 85 deaths per day -- setting limits and regulations on gun ownership is just one aspect to be considered in curbing the violence
- source: Comprehensive Public Health Approach Urged to Curb Gun Violence in U.S at

Eighty five gun deaths per day!  Over 30000 a year!  That is equal to a World Trade Center tragedy per month, or nearly four Newtowns per day!  If this many people were being killed by anything but guns, we would make it a number one priority to deal with it by any means possible.  We all remember what freedoms we were willing to sacrifice as a result of the World Trade Center, but we are not willing to sacrifice even the most egregious weapons - large magazines or assault weapons - in the face of these numbers.

Im a frayed knot :: Four Newtowns a day, a World Trade Center a month
I very clearly remember Columbine.  My son knew kids there, many of my coworkers had children there.  It was frightening and everybody was numb with grief.  It was tragic and it was senseless.

However, in the wake of Columbine, I began to be bothered by something, and it bothers me in regard to Newtown.  Columbine was an upscale, primarily white community, as is Newtown.  The nation was riveted by this senselessness, it seemed, in part because the children who were killed were upper middle class in what was perceived to be a safe neighborhood.  However, as tragic as each death at Columbine was, as tragic as each death at Newtown was, there are more children killed by gun violence every day than were killed at either school.  Many of these children are on their way to or from school, or hanging out in their own neighborhoods.  Every one of these deaths is as tragic as each Columbine or Newtown death was.  But the country merely mentions them in passing, if at all.  Why is that?

Is it because they are killed in onzies and twozies?  Is it because many are of color or poor?  Is it because the perps are often gang members or have a criminal element to them?  Is it because we assume (incorrectly in most cases) that the victims are not innocent?  Whatever the reason, these deaths are as tragic as are the deaths of the Columbine and Newtown shootings.

Imagine if they were as thoroughly reported as were the mass shootings (including Aurora and the Sikh Temple).  How would the country react?  If this country realized that we suffer 4 Newtowns a day, 5 Auroras and 5 Columbines a day, a World Trade Center each and month, would we tolerate these weapons that have no purpose but to kill?  Is this the message we need to drive home?

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Thanks for posting, I'm A Frayed Knot... (2.00 / 19)
and great to see you here, my friend! I'm a little battered from attempting to discuss this topic rationally over at the Orange Place today. [I know, I know...what was I thinking.] But I did want to contribute the money quote from Jon Stewart's wonderful segment last night on The Daily Show, about how right wing extremism has shut down any progress towards reasonable gun regulations:

Their paranoid fear of a possible dystopic future prevents us from addressing our actual dystopic present.  We can't even begin to address 30,000 gun deaths that are actually, in reality, happening in this country every year, because a few of us must remain vigilant against the rise of imaginary Hitler.

One friendly note about a typo in your post: The Wisconsin mass shooting was at a Sikh Temple.

I look forward to engaging in healthy, civil conversations with fellow Mooq. But prolly not tonight...

Ho'oponopono. To make things right; restore harmony; heal.

I am an engineer (2.00 / 18)
I am not expected to spell.  j/k, thank you.  When I figure out how to edit here I will fix that and add some tags.  Thank you for calling that to my attention.

[ Parent ]
And sorry about mis-capitalizing your username. (2.00 / 16)
I couldn't tell from the diary title how your were spelling yourself here. ;-)

Nice to see you in purple. It looks great on you!

Ho'oponopono. To make things right; restore harmony; heal.

[ Parent ]
Purple is my favorite color (2.00 / 15)
And you can see why I felt safer posting this on the Moose rather than GOS

[ Parent ]
The staggering thing is the NRA have managed to stop knowledge (2.00 / 17)
There's no national tracking of gun deaths - even though the casualties since 1970 amount to 1.4 million, more than US casualties in both World Wars combined.

I think slate have begun to try to track the gun deaths since Newtown. For a Brit who loves America, the lawless obsession with weapons is that one thing that I'll never get.  

The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'

They are worshipped (2.00 / 12)
Like the old house idols of ancient times

[ Parent ]
As an American I'll never get the lawless obsession with weapons either. (2.00 / 15)
Especially as someone who lives in the Chicago suburbs where we hear about shootings every day, I'll never get it.  

[ Parent ]
Slate has partnered with the @gun_deaths (who collects and tweets each (2.00 / 3)
gun death).  It is staggering.  Last I checked almost 500 deaths since Newtown.  But LaPierre is annoyed we're still talking about it.  Ass.

Honestly, I believe that there are many who see incidences like Columbine and Newtown as the price paid for the 2ndend Amendment.  Suicides?  Heh, so?  Gang violence? Heh, so?  A Goddamned member of Congress was shot in the head and no one was bothered enough to act.    Took 20 dead innocent children to get us to think about a conversation,

To slightly contradict myself though nice to see VPOTUS moving forward.

"When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in teh stupid and waving a gun" ~ Esteev on Wonkette

[ Parent ]
I'm a proud gun owner (2.00 / 9)
But refuse to join the NRA.

You know, this is an issue I'm divided on somewhat. I roll my eyes when I hear my friends at the shooting range talk about "gun grabers" and such- nobody's going to come into your home and take away any of your guns, this isn't some survivalist's wet dream. And while I own a 20-round magazine for my civilian-rated M14 rifle, I fully admit it's just for kicks. There's no reason I need it. I sure don't use it for hunting. I don't plan or have fantasies of engaging in urban warfare to save my family after the breakdown of society, blah blah blah. Most of the guns I own are single-shot; a shotgun for hunting, a Mosin Nagant bolt-action rifle for hunting and the fun of shooting.

I'd be all for a national marksmanship and gun training program. Like how you have to get a driver's license to drive a car; same deal. Heck, if we could make it so that if a gun you owned killed someone because you lent it to them, or you didn't have it properly secured, you ought to be charged with a felony. I'm sure there would be much screaming and nashing of teeth about that one, but you'd be darned sure that people would take securing their firearms very seriously.

There's plenty of serious things we can do without even coming close to any of the fevered imaginings of some of my friends.

The reality is... (2.00 / 9)
that the VAST majority of gun owners are like you, Rage.

The problem is that it is not reality that is controlling this is MONEY.

As long as the NRA is as well-funded as it is (and is thereby able to well-fund politicians to keep them in their pockets)...I just don't see much progress happening.

Sadly, it does not matter what the MAJORITY wants as long as the MONEY wants something else.


[ Parent ]
Indeed (2.00 / 6)
That's why I bought an M14. Anyone who wants to buy an M16-model or derivative has more money than brains, IMHO. They just want to look cool or, again, live out some sort of fevered fantasy in their head with the $3000 of accessories they plunk on the sucker. I bought mine because I can go hunting with it, and I can compete in marksmanship competitions with it. If I was hunting, I wouldn't use anything more than my 5-round mag. If I can hit a buck or doe in the first shot, anyhow, what good am I?

[ Parent ]
And this just popped up on Facebook feed... (2.00 / 8)
Gun Toting Soccer Mom Found Shot Dead

The woman in this story is almost a caracature of a "gun nut." Hell, her license to carry was revoked, and she was trying to sue the police chief who revoked it. Now she and her husband are dead in a murder suicide, leaving behind young children who witnessed the whole damn thing.

I'm starting to think that "tragedy" simply doesn't encompass enough when the gun culture in America goes horribly wrong.

There are so many factors, and we're going to have to multi task as a nation to address all the root causes. But....

let's start with the God Damned guns.

I'll dig out the link (2.00 / 8)

So that's the research from a year's worth of statistics. For every ONE successful gun self defence, TWENTY TWO accidents, murders or attempted murders, suicides or attempted suicide

That's one hell of a risky form of self defence. You might as well threaten to blow yourself up with a grenade

The p***artist formerly known as 'Brit'

[ Parent ]
Excellent points, Knot. (2.00 / 11)
If the NRA represented gun owners, they'd be more flexible. Unless I'm badly mistaken, they're a lobbying group for gun manufacturers, and the manufacturers don't want to cut off the gravy train that comes from gun shows, internet sales, and whipping up teh crazy with talk of protecting the 2nd Amendment.

Instead of talking about gun control, perhaps we should reframe the conversation by talking about gun sanity.

It's great to see your name in purple!

"Do your little bit of good where you are; it is those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world." ~ Desmond Tutu

Hi Kelley. Is Fierce to tip the comment? (2.00 / 7)
and Meh is in between?  

[ Parent ]
Hey Joe! (2.00 / 10)
Welcome to the Moose!

And the answer is: Yes.

Fail is fail and a very rare occurrence. Fierce is tip, good, agree, encourage. Meh is usually humorous, sometimes only partly so, and sometimes sincere but polite disagreement.

Since you are here, and your name is Joe, I assume you are a plumber. Help yourself to something from the kitchen, and while you are there the tap in the sink is dripping.


John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
I see Chris already answered your question. (2.00 / 6)
Welcome to purple world, joe!

"Do your little bit of good where you are; it is those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world." ~ Desmond Tutu

[ Parent ]
I saw something on NRA funding recently, (2.00 / 6)
and while I will get the details wrong if I try to repeat it, basically over the past number of years the NRA has changed from being member funded to manufacturer funded.

The NRA is a shameless whore for gun manufacturers and LaPierre is its pimp.

John Askren - "Never get into a pissing match with a skunk."

[ Parent ]
So why is it (2.00 / 4)
That the members have no say about who is their head cheese

[ Parent ]
I guess you'd have to ask the NRA members. (2.00 / 3)
I'm sure the NRA is getting feedback from them. This "all or none" bullshit only flies with extremists.

"Do your little bit of good where you are; it is those little bits of good put together that overwhelm the world." ~ Desmond Tutu

[ Parent ]
Hi there, so good to see you again. I would like to engage (2.00 / 4)
in reasonable conversation about a number of topics, this being one.

I have guns. I used to be very ignorant about them: never held or shot one until I was about 25. Then I was taught well, and how to handle firearms. As I became comfortable using guns, I became less adamant about banning all guns.

I totally believe in treating guns like we treat cars: learn, certificate (license), register, retrain, recertify. Then limit types of guns and ammunition. Armour piercing rounds are for battles against the police. Not okay. Large clips are scary from a need to reload perspective. I didn't know until last month that hunters are restricted to 3 rounds chambered. Good.

In 'Bowling for Columbine' Michael Moore looked at Canada, which has a lot of guns, but so much less homicide. He couldn't explain the difference. But they are more regulated.

I hope that Biden, his group, and the President will be able to put some sanity back into our practices and regulations.

The slippery slop arguments made by Republicans seems to cover many areas of discourse and policy. This approach shuts down moving in more reasonable directions.

Thank you for this discussion.  


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